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There were many 10mm enthusiast that were biting at the bit for these pistols to become a reality!
Fortis Weblog
March 1st, 2008
The Antithesis of Chaos…
The antithesis of Chaos is generally held to be “Cosmos” — and in our case, Cosmos is the new Finite Element Analysis program that we are using to test the Fortis. Vltor Weapons Systems has brought on some new folks to help out with the Fortis Project, and the investment is paying off well!
As previously stated, we have made some internal changes, in order to make the Fortis more reliable, stronger and safer than the original pistol — currently there are a few computer models that are undergoing repeated testing in computer simulation. The Finite Element Analysis testing allows us to look at areas of potential concern… and we are proud to say is showing us that the changes we have made are indeed improvements.
We are working to make the final refinements to the designs, and we are quite confident that when we move to “hard steel” prototype testing, that real range time will validate the time and cost we have invested in the extensive computer modeling and simulations.
As always… we will keep you posted as things move along — thanks for reading and check back soon.March 1st, 2008
The Word is Out…
Today was supposed to be the “official” launch of the Fortis Information Page, but it looks like the blog was discovered a bit early… seems the Google Bots have been busy!
I am turning off the ability for readers to leave comments… this is a decision that is in line with Vltor’s long standing practice of not participating in open Internet discussion forums – please understand that the reason we do this, is that historically any post will eventually turn into a “he said, she said” contest, then open arguing and unwarranted disparaging comments are made, trolls arrive, and soon the intent of the original post is lost forever.
This webpage was created to provide “direct from the source” information about the Fortis Pistol and to keep those interested informed of progress — this is the only source for official information.
Naturally, we want and encourage your feedback, please feel free share you comments or ideas with us! Feel free to email us with anything you want us to hear. Thanks and keep an eye on this page.May 5th, 2008
Sorry for the delay…
It has been far too long since we have updated the blog… so there is really a lot to cover. Things are moving along very well with the Fortis, actually better than we could have ever hoped for.
Our engineering models are done and they have been undergoing Finite Element Analysis for a few weeks now – the results of this testing show that the internal changes we have made are indeed improvements over the original design.
While striving to retain the original appearance and ergonomics of the Bren Ten, we have addressed nearly every internal part of the pistol – the Fortis incorporates many changes and improvements to part design, materials and manufacturing technique.
So, it would seem that the “big news” around here is that we are satisfied with most of the engineering and design work, and we are ready to start prototyping parts… that would seem to be the big news; and would be, if not for what happened about a month ago.
In our search to find out as much as possible about the original Bren Ten, we were able to get all of the original blueprints, engineering notes, designs and drawings – even the design and data packages for never produced versions. There is no way to describe how much this has helped us, we can honestly say now that the Fortis is not just a reverse engineered, slightly modified version of the Bren Ten – the Fortis is the next generation of the Bren Ten! Now, so much more than ever, this is more than continuing the legacy – this is about evolving the “greatest handgun ever made” into the Greatest Handgun Ever… period.
With every step we take, we are picking up more support… we have made some great friends and met some truly wonderful people. There are a lot of great things in the future, and we are honored to be able to make them happen.
Thanks for your support,
The Vltor/Fortis TeamMay 7th, 2008
So, let’s hear from you…
We are getting so many great comments that we decided to turn the “leave comments” function back on; please feel free to leave your comments, ideas, concerns… good or bad, just please keep it civil.July 4th, 2008
So… will it have magazines?
Yep… that is just one of the milestones that we have reached and passed in the last couple of months. Before I get into some of the details, I want to say that we took a deliberate setback on our schedule over the last few weeks; if you read that last entry, you saw that we were able to secure all of the original blue prints, engineering notes, designs and data from the original Dornhaus & Dixon pistols – including never released designs.
We chose to use that opportunity to audit all of our designs and ensure that the external appearance and ergonomics of our designs matched the original drawings as closely as possible… they do, the Fortis is a carbon copy of the original Bren.
So, where are we at with building it?
The good news is that we are cutting steel… we have many of the internal parts done, we have developed special tooling and fixtures, have finalized selection of outside suppliers and hard parts for the Fortis pistol are on the bench!
The designs have underwent literally days of Finite Element Analysis, and the results show that the Fortis is strong… the Fortis is more than up to the challenge of handling the full power 10MM Auto cartridge. The slides are undergoing the pre-machining heat treatment and will be on the machine shop floor soon; the Fortis slide is machined from solid bar stock, no casting.
Actually, we have eliminated several cast parts from the original Bren design… with today’s Live Tool and high speed machines, advanced 5th Axis techniques, EDM cutting and other modern manufacturing techniques… it is actually just as fast and cost efficient to make a lot of the originally cast parts from solid stock. Add to this the fact that we are able to select from state-of-the-art materials that were unavailable only a few years ago; and once again, we are quite comfortable saying that the Fortis is the finest pistol made.
Oh, one big question we get… Yes, we have magazines; the .45ACP is a 10 round magazine and the 10MM is a 15 round magazine, the price is no more than you would pay for any current production mag, and availability is not a problem. The only down side is that they will not retrofit the original Bren Ten.
Stay tuned folks… things are starting to move quickly.September 20th 2008
A Short Message…
Hopefully though, long on content.
We realize it has been a while, but this really is a case of “No News is Good News” — Things are moving along just fine. We did want to reassure folks that the Fortis Project is doing well, and share with you an idea of where we are.
We are making a pretty good size run of pistols, all of these are still prototype, but things are working out great! All of the internal parts are done and we are busy cutting others… we have suppliers for the grips, magazines and every part that we are not making — and as all along, this stuff is as good as it gets.
But heck, talk is cheap… everyone likes pictures; so here are a few, we’ll be putting more up and sharing some more details of the Fortis release soon. Thanks for hanging in there…November 20th, 2008
because you asked…
I was watching a science fiction show on the television this morning… some story about a guy that travels back in time, and how he has to deal with the difficulty of things he once took for granted, being impossible to even manufacture in the past.
The Fortis Pistol Project has been a lot like the premise of that show; it has been an opportunity for us to recreate the past, using today’s technology, and to really learn to appreciate the differences… let me give you an example.
The heart of an auto pistol is the barrel and slide, the fit between the two has to be precise and repeatable; without effecting reliability and function. It has always been the accepted practice to hand fit these parts, or to live with a loose fit – but that was then, this is now.
We continue to design, test and refine the Fortis… and we continue to explore how to best exploit the materials and manufacturing techniques available to us today. Take a look at our newest slides and barrels: by using modern alloys and sophisticated machining and heat treating processes, we are able to produce slide and barrel combinations that are of perfect fit, function and finish – something that quite simply could not have been done, even as recently as twenty-five years ago.
Oh, and of course you get some pictures of the newest slides and barrels…
So, in order to catch everyone up with the Fortis project, let’s take this opportunity to go over some of the more common questions, here goes:
Is the Fortis done? Well, no… but there is a Fortis, and we are down to making small changes – mostly to manufacturing techniques and fewer and fewer to the actual design. We still have some work to do, but more and more, we see the word “when” being replaced by “now that”.
So, when will it be done? We are still shooting for SHOT 09 as the debut of the production Fortis.
Are you taking pre-orders? Not yet… but this will be the first place that we will announce when we are.
How much will it cost? We are comfortable with saying that the standard Fortis will have a retail price of less than a thousand dollars.
How many models will there be? The first release will be of the standard model, this pistol is externally identical to the original Bren Ten, but with several internal improvements – it will be available in several combinations of 10MM or .45ACP; standard or short slide; and light or dark finishes.
What about the magazines? This is the one we get all the time… more than a few of you have figured it out though: we have designed the Fortis to use commercially available magazines from the EAA Witness line of pistols – we will of course offer our own Fortis magazine, but you will be able to use over the counter Witness magazines. Oh, and we have thousands of magazines on the way.The Fortis will have its own magazine… the original design of the floor plate is as much part of the Bren Ten look, as the “castle” barrel bushing. Regular, over the counter EAA Witness magazines will work in the Fortis, but we have thousands of Fortis magazines!
Thanks for your support; we are getting closer and closer.
The Vltor Fortis TeamDecember 10th, 2008
Staying the Course…
We just wanted to make a quick update and let everyone know that things are going great. It is no secret that the current climate and associated “gun buying frenzy” has all manufactures and dealers buried with demands… but amazingly we are staying pretty much on track with the Fortis.
Rest assured, the current economic situation will not hamper the development or production of the Fortis. We identified what we thought were shortcomings with the other attempts to bring this pistol to market and eliminated or overcame those concerns from the start; this project was fully funded at the beginning
Check out the picture of the receivers! We are calling these the last of the preproduction receivers… the next time we order receivers, it will be the big order, and that day is not at all far off. Again, thanks for hanging in there, it will be worth the wait.February 11th ,2009
so finally…
Some official follow up from the SHOT Show!
First off, we had a great show; we brought six pre-production guns to show and they were very well received. The interest in the Fortis seems to exceed our initial thoughts and the feedback we got from show attendees was most favorable and positive.
And then, enter the Internet Forum.
One of the interesting things that we have done with the Fortis Project, is this blog; it is a (nearly) real time glimpse into the development of the pistol, unlike the conventional marketing aspect of releasing a production product to the market with a “there it is, and it is what it is” statement. The down side to this is that it leaves the project open to much more speculation than normal. The Speculators, free to post their ideas on the many Internet Forums, remain largely free of any contradictory facts… that is, until we update this blog – as always, this is the only source of official Fortis information.
Rumor Control:
We are not yet taking pre-orders, the first step towards the Fortis release will most likely be the opportunity to reserve serial numbers – this will be announced on this blog when it happens.
Fortis production is NOT limited to 2,500 pistols… while that is our target goal for the first run, we will continue to make the original Fortis for as long as there is a demand.
The first release of the Fortis is designed to be as faithful to the original Bren Ten as possible, it looks like it does, because that is what the original Bren looked like – we did take some liberty with all silver “Vice” model, which of course pays homage to the unique pistol used in a popular television show.
We have not changed the “lines” of the frame… the guns that were shown at Shot 09 were on pre-production frames and, while nearly identical to the original Bren, these are not what will be used on the production gun. We do have the drawings, designs and prints from the original Bren, and the Standard Model Fortis is a dead ringer in the looks department.
Yes, there will be other models in the future, but future models will be a marked departure from the original Bren Ten – we hope to use the basic design as a springboard to advance the original concept into a more modern design; however, for now, the only models that are being made are the four different designs that were shown at Shot 09.
The four designs that we showed at Shot 09 were the (1) Standard Model, (2) Vice Model, (3) Special Forces Dark and, (4) Special Forces Light.
The short slide version of the Fortis is called the “Special Forces” model because… well, you can probably guess, that is what the short slide version of the original Bren was called.
Yes… the Gunsite Raven will be used on the Fortis, with permission from Gunsite.
The Fortis is very nice to shoot… the ergonomics and design of the pistol make shooting even full power 10mm Auto very controllable and comfortable – the current long slide Fortis weighs 2.25 pounds empty.
The 10mm Auto pushes a 180+ grain bullet at 1200+ feet per second… there are 15 of them in a Fortis magazine.
The Fortis is designed to use standard Witness magazines… we offer the Fortis with a magazine the replicates the look of the original Bren floor plate, but the magazine body is dimensionally identical to the Witness magazine.
The Fortis grip is not wider than the original Bren Ten; in fact, it is… well, here is what our Lead Engineer sent me about this topic: VLTOR has stated from the beginning that the FORTIS will adhere as close as possible to the original weapons as possible – and we have adhered to that fervently. Criticism regarding the widening of the grip area of the weapon is unfounded. In fact, the FORTIS is actually narrower in the grip area than the original weapon. Changes are planned in the grip area to make the ‘feel’ more true to the original, but rumors that we’ve increased ANY dimensions in the grip are untrue. The receiver is perhaps closer to the original than any other FORTIS component, save for the slide-stop for obvious reasons. We are very proud of this achievement, and hope that those claiming that this area is any wider will trust us on this – the new magazine fits with NO change to the grip. Also understand that any and all changes made to components were made for one of several reasons. Either the original part was not satisfactory in performance (the extractor), or did not lend itself well to either casting or CNC machining (IE: sear housing). We’ve tried to employ the highest quality processes throughout, and it shows in the final product. The FORTIS is rock-solid.
The FORTIS is the culmination of 20 years of dreams, 2 years of in-depth engineering and analysis, 9 months of collaboration with those that knew the most about the original guns, and 5 months of manufacturing setup. The results are high-quality parts that are optimized to production, while functioning more reliably in a similar form-factor to the original so that the final product, though very similar in all conceivable aspects, truly is an all-NEW endeavor. We believe that it is this dedication that will be most appreciated by our potential customers, those that want the gun of a man’s man: AMERICAN made, all steel, chambered for a HOT cartridge, plenty of capacity, and the level of quality one would come to expect from us.
Really not much else to say after that… Range testing continues, the Fortis is coming.
April 2nd, 2009
we’ve come this far…
Well, we have an excuse for being at least one day late; we did not want to make a post on April Fool’s Day… but we did want to make another post to assure everyone that the Fortis Pistol is alive and well, it has not fallen victim to “the Curse”.
Okay, so here is the real deal: Unless you have been living in a cave, in the remote mountain regions of Asscrackistan, you know that there has been an overwhelming surge in the sales and demand for anything firearms related… this demand started last November and curiously skyrocketed around the third week of January, only weeks after we returned from SHOT ’09.
Of course Vltor has a great deal of product that sits at the top of this burgeoning demand, but a lot of folks may not know that there are many goodies under our roof that are not found on the Vltor website – many of these lesser known items are delivered on government contracts and naturally take priority.
So… to be perfectly honest, with the onslaught of orders for existing products, we did push the Fortis to back of the table a bit, but it is still on the table and headway is still being made. Here is a quick update: All of the final design work to the frame has been finished, and the frame is production ready; the grips have been redesigned with a slight change to the “swell” which fills the hand much better (really, really nice); the production barrels are done; and several other little spring/screw/clip things have been finalized.
We have also increased the size of our production facility and have spent many hours designing new fixtures and tooling, we have given a lot of attention to increasing our production ability and we are installing a few million dollars worth of new machinery, most of this with an eye exclusively on the production of the Fortis Pistol.
Rest assured, the Fortis is still going to happen, but also rest assured that the time we temporarily took away from the Fortis has been well spent; we have been able to continue answering the phones, shipping product and most importantly filling contract orders to get essential product to our war fighters.July 27, 2009
But… I read it on the Internet
It seems there has been a lot of speculation lately about the Fortis Pistol… and we have had to sit back and watch, reluctant and unable to say anything. Which makes it that much harder for us to now say that the most pernicious of the internet rumors are true: the Fortis Pistol is no more.
There is only one reason for this decision, because we have been able to get the rights to use the original Bren Ten name and logo… The Fortis is now the Bren Ten!
We have to apologize for the last several weeks; we have been in sort of a self-imposed blackout while we have been negotiating the agreement to use the Bren Ten name. This is something that we really wanted, in order to make the release of our pistol truly the continuation of the legacy – and something that we have been working hard to make happen.
Of course, that is not the only thing we have been working on… the Fortis project has continued, it never has been in jeopardy. The malignant internet rumors are exactly that, rumors on the internet. We also have been working hard to keep our existing products going out of the door; we have contracts and support service for military weapons and the overwhelming demand for anything firearm related with the general public. Vltor makes a lot of parts that are the mainstay of many dealer’s product line, as well as OEM parts for other manufacturers and vendors – while the opportunity was certainly there to take advantage of the situation, we actually shut down our commercial internet sales and focused on keeping out product shipping to our dealers and distributors.
The Fortis was announced with the intention of it being one of our upcoming projects, during a time when our production was starting to outpace demands; there is no way we could have foreseen the unprecedented demand that has swept across the firearms industry. Even before the recent increase in product demand, we were in the process of bringing in new machinery and people; in the last few months we have brought in literally millions of dollars worth of new machinery, much of which is just for the new pistol. In one area alone, we have added four new horizontal milling machines, each with multiple pallet changers, we have modernized our metal finishing shop to keep up with the increased demands, yet not compromise an ounce of quality – and even with all of these steps to modernize and improve production, we have not cut a single job; in fact, we have added more production and development staff to continue production and support development.
So, here is the word from Rumor Control:
• The first issue of the Fortis Pistol will be released as the Bren Ten.
• There is nothing wrong with the design, it is working fine.
• Yep, we have magazines… lots of magazines.
• The project is not broke, nor has it been sold, it was fully funded from the start.
• “There must be something going on” – there was, we were waiting to see what name to mark on the slides of the new pistol, we like Bren Ten. We are sure you will too.November 30, 2009
the eleventh hour…
Coming off of a four-day weekend is tough, it is even tougher when I look at the calendar and see that we have less than two months until The SHOT Show.
Bringing a new handgun to market… There are a lot of things that many folks may now think about: Product insurance, marketing, advertising, customer support; all things that really need to be taken care of before one starts taking orders.
We’ve got all that taken care of.
Over the past several weeks, we have (while continuing to finish the production Bren) been busy getting all of these things taken care of. We are in the final stages of negotiation with a distributor, that will handle all of the commercial sales for the new Fortis. That distributor will be collocated with us at the The SHOT Show.
The Bren itself is in final production and testing… the first showing will at booths 20271 and 20171, in the Law Enforcement Section of the 2010 SHOT Show.
Which is less than two months away…January 25, 2010
SHOT Show 2010…
We are back from the SHOT Show, and just wanted to update a few things that some may have missed:
1. The new Vltor Bren Ten is in production and being marked “Bren Ten”.
2. The first year of production has been sold for distribution.
3. The first release of the Bren Ten is a faithful reproduction of the original in appearance, things that were not on the original Bren (light rail, etc) will not be on the Vltor Bren Ten. There are, however, numerous internal changes; there is no parts interchangeability between the Vltor Bren Ten and the Original Bren.
4. The first production numbers are limited, but there will be more than 1200 guns.
5. Full details, including pricing and availability will come from Sporting Products, despite what you may have read on some Internet forum.February 16, 2010
Press Release – 16 Feb, 2010
The management and production team of Vltor Weapon Systems announced today, that in spite of ongoing discussions in the matter, the new Vltor Bren Ten pistol will not be marked with the Gunsite Raven Logo. Eric Kincel, the General Manager for Vltor, said that they were able to obtain the rights to the original “Bren Ten” name, as well as the original “X” logo, but could not reach an agreement for the use of the Gunsite Raven logo. Production of the Vltor Bren Ten pistol marks the resurgence of the renowned firearm design of the late Colonel Jeff Cooper. Originally launched in the early 1980s, the Bren Ten pistol has never gone into full scale production, yet it has created a large and lasting demand in the firearms industry. The Vltor Bren Ten is manufactured by Vltor Weapon Systems of Tucson, AZ and distributed exclusively by Sporting Products, LLC of Florida.
For more information:
Sporting Products, LLC – http://www.sportingproducts.com
Vltor Weapon Systems – http://www.vltor.comJune 03,2010
what is going on?
By vltor 1 Comment
Categories: Uncategorized
There has been a lot of talk about the delayed release of the Bren Ten, and trust me when I say we have been listening. We had shut this site down when we turned everything over to Sporting Products, but we feel it is time to get back in touch with everyone and let you get the word straight from the source – I feel that we have not only a responsibility to be the ones that tell you about this, but we have an obligation to tell you why.
Earlier this year, Abrams Airborne Manufacturing (the parent company of Vltor) received a large contract from the U.S. Marine Corps for the M-32A1, Multiple-Shot Grenade Launcher; additionally, we had received other smaller orders for the Grenade Launcher from other DOD and military organizations. Given the critical need and immediate demand for these weapons, we shifted a great deal of our resources towards getting these done.
This brings us up to just a few weeks ago… we were faced with a really tough call, but one that simply had to be made: we were just not satisfied with the one of the castings. After assembly and testing of the production pistols, parts of the pistol design just did not meet our expectations. Keep in mind, we made many changes to the internal mechanism of the new Bren, and the problem that we were seeing is not a quality or material problem, it is simply that we knew that we could make the final product better. So we are.
This is a set-back, but is not a show-stopper… I know that all of the explanations and reasons in the world are not going to please some folks, and we do not blame those of you that are disappointed or even angry. Just think how we feel about this, the Bren has always been a labor of love for us, the only reason we are doing this is because we all here really believe it is something that needed to be done.
I do want to say that from the start, we have never taken any down payments or reserved a serial number – we have not even taken a purchase order from the distributor yet. We are still engaged in this and we have as much desire and enthusiasm devoted to this as anyone – I hope that you can hang in there a little while longer, we are opening the blog back up and it will be the point of contact from here on out.Mar 31, 2011
Some Changes…
By vltor Leave a Comment
Categories: New Posts
We would like to inform our customers, industry partners and friends that Sporting Products of West Palm Beach, FL is no longer handling the distribution or sales of the Vltor Bren Ten pistol – this news came to us recently from Sporting Products and we are unable to make any further comments regarding the dissolution.
We do want to let everyone know that we are bringing the full management and oversight of the Vltor Bren Ten back under our roof; effective immediately the design, manufacture, marketing and distribution of the Bren Ten will be solely and squarely on Vltor Weapon Systems and Abrams Airborne Manufacturing. We hope that this repositioning will allow us to not only oversee this project from start to finish, but that it will also put us in direct contact with the retailers and customers. In the next few weeks, we will reestablish our presence on the Internet and open the forum to provide updated and candid information about the Bren Ten pistol.
We do want to say that beyond our initial discussions to use Sporting Products as the sole distributor of the Bren Ten, we have not committed to any pre-orders or sales agreements, nor have we received any down payment for any of the Bren Ten pistols. If you believe that you have a purchase agreement of any type for the Bren Ten, you should contact Sporting Products directly with your concerns.
Again, we hope to make the best of this event and get the Vltor Bren Ten to the shooting market as soon as possible. -
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My letter to VLTOR
VLTOR dig Dec 30th 2015
10mm Dreamin’
Once upon a time around 2008, I had dreams of a “New Standard Vice Model 10mm Bren Ten” from VLTOR as they touted their FORTIS pistol. This went on for some time and then there was the prepaid buy ins back in the early 2010.
Quote
A reply from Robin, stated that we should prepay the gun asap, because there is going to be a limited run of these made and you want to be as high on the list as possible.The Standard Vice model 10mm was to retail $1199.99…I shot on over to Bass Pro Shop in Denham Springs outside of Baton Rouge to get my money paid and in que for one of these. The money was in place as we anticipated the delivery of the pistols. Anyone who has followed the history of this knows that our dreams were shattered by the fact none were going to be sold…Still to this date, all discussions of manufacture of this pistol have dissolved into the sands of time!
The dream still replays…So “Mr. Sandman, bring me a dream (bum, bum, bum, bum)”,
VLTOR Make her the cutest that I’ve ever seen.
Please turn on your 10mm Miami Vice beam.
Mister Sandman, bring us,
Please, please, please,
Mister Sandman, bring us a fulfilled, not a shattered dream.January 1, 2016 11:55 am
Vltor Hi Wade- as we have stated numerous times, we never gave any information to any distributors to start taking money for pistols. So we are very sorry to those people who tried to put in preorders. The Bren is still having plenty of resources allocated to it. As we have been very clear that we are having to put other projects in the back burner so we can spend funds for the Bren. Keep in mind we also have to balance our military/law enforcement contracts, civilian sales, as well as what is in our employees best interest as well. We will update any Bren information that we get from management as soon as we have it.Vltor Happy New Year to you gentlemen as well. Please know that we are still allocating numerous resources away from current projects and towards the Bren project. This was never an easy project but we still are trying to make progress on it. We will have an update from our management as soon as possible.
Like many potential customers, I too had hopes for this Fortis pistol and even did the pre-paid thing with my local Bass Pro Shop.
As the time neared one year of having my money on fill with Bass Pro Shop, I opted to cancel out.
As we all found out that these Fortis Pistols were UNOBTANIUM! -
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